Theater boards and casting decisions
Printed From: Community Theater Green Room
Category: Producing Theater
Forum Name: Directing
Forum Discription: For questions about handling shows, actors, crew, board members, children ...or do we repeat ourselves?
URL: http://www.communitytheater.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4960
Printed Date: 5/03/24 at 8:39pm
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Topic: Theater boards and casting decisions
Posted By: NDTENOR
Subject: Theater boards and casting decisions
Date Posted: 2/05/11 at 4:34pm
A two part question:
1) As a director, should the choice of who you cast be in any way affected by members of the board of directors of the theater or influenced by others having some influence in the theater.
2) As a director,are there any circumstances where you would base casting decisions on factors which have nothing to do with a persons ability and talent that was demonstrated at the audition? And what might these be?
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Replies:
Posted By: edh915
Date Posted: 2/05/11 at 10:22pm
Sounds like a trick question, but I'll bite...
1) If you're saying should I choose a particular actor simply because they have political or personal connections with a person of influence within the theatre group, or choose a particular actor because a person of influence within the group has indicated that they would like me to; I would reply with an emphatic no. It's never happened to me, and I would never allow it to. I could never direct any show for anyone under those circumstances. If I don't have integrity, then I have nothing.
2) The only circumstance I can think of that might influence my decision to cast someone exclusive of what I've seen at auditions would be if I were warned against that particular actor as being unreliable or disruptive. And even then I wouldn't just take one person's word for it. If I have first-hand knowledge, based on past experience, that the actor is difficult to work with, then no amount of persuasion would convince me to give the actor another try. In that respect I'm afraid I am like Mr. Darcy. "My good opinion, once lost, is lost forever."
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Posted By: Majicwrench
Date Posted: 2/05/11 at 11:14pm
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Indeed could be a trick, but discussion is good.
I can certainly see casting someone for reasons other than just the audition. Theatre does not live in a vacuum, and yes, I consider things other than just the audition. I have a young lady I use often, she is a wonderful actress, punctual and polite. The fact that she has a huge family and they all suport the theatre is not lost on me and does influence my decisions concerning her roles.
That said, if someone, say from a board of directors, tried TELLING me who and whom not to cast, that would not go over well with me.
I firmly believe in supporting the people who support me.
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Posted By: PaulyWally
Date Posted: 2/05/11 at 11:15pm
1) Your question may sound pretty basic, but I don't believe that we can foresee every possible scenario. I have been involved in some productions where the "rules" were bent because someone had some kind of influence... and the results were often very positive.
I just think it all depends on the situation. One thing for sure, I don't think the director should direct differently or show any sort of favoritism once rehearsals start. The cast loses respect for the director, and the actor hijacks the production.
2) See #1.
The director's job responsibilities are not static. And as a leader, s/he will have to make tough decisions with imperfect data. Having a loose policy is not the enemy (nor is having strict policies)... it is the way a leader handles conflict that inevitably determines the morale and respect of the team, and the success of the production.
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Posted By: NDTENOR
Date Posted: 2/06/11 at 2:07pm
Look.... I appreciate the candor in the responses so far and , to me , there is no "right" or "wrong" answer. But even in three responses there are differences in interpretation and philosophy of this question and I understand that differences in philosophy exist.
My only qualm, as an actor, has to do with the appropriate and constructive use of my personal time to attend an audition which can sometimes take 2 or 3 hours.
If , for instance , I could only attend one of three auditions given by the above different directors then obviously it would be, if I knew something about their "philosophy" before hand , to my advantage to attend the audition of edh915. And if I could attend more than one then it might or might not be my choice to attend the other two.
I guess over the years it has just become more and more irksome to attend some auditions that , essentially, were a waste of time to attend. Time is a very precious commodity.
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Posted By: PaulyWally
Date Posted: 2/06/11 at 2:31pm
Originally posted by NDTENOR
I guess over the years it has just become more and more
irksome to attend some auditions that , essentially, were a waste of
time to attend. Time is a very precious commodity.
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I think your frustrations are fair. But I also look at it like this:
1) Time is certainly a very precious commodity... especially for actors
that have to hold down another full-time job so they may act. But your
time is also what you make of it. I don't know a single actor that
doesn't need practice auditioning. If you spend time at an audition
thinking it's a waste, then I doubt you'll learn anything from it and
then it will be a waste.
2) Auditioning is one way actors advertise themselves. But it's not
the only way. And the more involved an actor gets in their local scene,
the more contacts they make, and the more opportunity to use networking
as an advertising tool instead of just auditioning. And if your time
really is that precious, then maybe you can also find more productive
ways to get your name out there.
The bottomline is, luck favors the object in motion. If you are doing
the bare minimum by only attending auditions, then you will see minimum
results. Successful actors market themselves well. They use every
possible influence they have to gain work and experience. And if that
means getting their foot in the door by utilizing a board member, then
that's what it means.
Sorry if this doesn't jive with your philosophy. But that's how it is in the world. And it only gets worse the higher you go up the ladder.
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Posted By: Majicwrench
Date Posted: 2/06/11 at 6:22pm
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I wouldn't want you to think that I hold auditions and have already pre-cast part. If I am holding auditions for particular parts, you can bet it is not pre-cast. I am not fond of auditions and if I could pre-cast everybody I would, and then just skip auditioning.
. BUT if I have two actors, both give good readings, look the part, seem like good people, and one is a board members son/daughter (just for an example) that will weigh in on my decision.
Keith
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Posted By: NDTENOR
Date Posted: 2/07/11 at 8:42am
Well... I'd like to hear what edh195 might say about the previous comments.
Look... my take is this is as follows. Casting bias ( I don't really like the term pre-casting ) is a very "slippery slope" which ultimately leads to overall poorer quality productions. I'm not saying bad productions. I'm just saying poorer quality productions.
One of the reasons is that the "word" gets around,( as theater people are know to talk), and you get fewer people showing up for auditions. And because of this less of a "talent pool" to choose from. And the quality of shows suffer. But then again.... some people really don't care.
At least where I live there are quit a few community theaters to choose from. I would much prefer auditioning for a group where I had some chance than a group for which I had little or no chance.
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Posted By: Rorgg
Date Posted: 2/07/11 at 5:29pm
Obviously, there's some actual situation here. I'll just try to address this generally:
1. You actually have two questions here. The first one is, should it be affected by members of the board. And here, I'll say... maybe, see my answer to number 2. Your second question is, should it be affected by who has influence, and I'll say no.
2. Yes. As a director, I want the best people for the part. And, as such, I will be led by what I learn from the auditions plus any other information germane to the decision.
Let me give a couple examples that are relevant, and not all too uncommon:
* A while back, I was directing a one-act as part of a night of such, and we did a combined audition, because some actors would end up cast in multiple roles across shows. The general course was simply to do cold readings, and there was one fellow who gave a pretty bad cold read. Despite this, he ended up cast in 3 of the 4 shows. Why? Because we knew he could act -- he'd been in a previous production, at which he'd given a similarly bad read, but got cast anyway just due to lack of alternatives, and gave a good performance ... and we all knew this tale.
* In my last directing gig, at the end of auditions, I sat down with my AD and SM (who sat in on the audition). We had 3 medium-to-large parts and 3 women of a similar age with sufficient talent to fill the roles. In discussing the choice with them, we placed one of the three, and were left with two for two spots. I favored one girl for the larger role based on the read she gave for it, but she'd given an inferior read for another part, and based on that the AD and SM were of the opposite opinion, and I thought they made good points.
Here's where #1 comes in. I called in the producer, who'd worked with both of them before and asked for her opinion -- she'd been working the door, and hadn't seen the audition, but I needed MORE information. And she gave some valuable insight on both of them that helped make the decision, and given the outcome, helped make the RIGHT decision.
So... yes. You have the last word on this, and in no way should you give this up (this is part of the reason I won't co-direct again ... the casting session drove me up a wall ... casting's a painful enough experience when you only have to fight your own mind). However, you shouldn't be afraid to take other information into account if you think it will help you make your decision, and sometimes, board members and the like can be a valuable aid in that.
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Posted By: NDTENOR
Date Posted: 2/07/11 at 11:46pm
Mr. Rorgg:
Thank you for your opinion and I appreciate your comment. But obviously there is a big difference between getting other peoples " unbiased" opinion about an audition and one which is "affected" by factors which have no particular connection to the persons ability to perform a particular role. If you can get others opinions on an audition which are fair and unbiased then I think that is a perfectly wonderful thing to do. Two or three heads are sometimes better than one.
But just how sure are you of that?
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Posted By: KEB54
Date Posted: 2/08/11 at 1:09am
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Yeah, there really seems to be a particular issue here. I don't think you are helping your cause by airing it here. If I was a potential future director of your's, I'd certainly take note of it. One thing I have learned in this business is not to burn bridges. EVERYONE is a potential future collaborator.
1) In an ideal world a director should not have his casting influenced by anyone. Hopefully the board, who has hired you, has the confidence in you to cast appropriately. However, in the real world, people try to influence decissions. That goes far beyond theatre. It is in everything we do from job decisions, to pollitics, to what brand of cereal you buy. It happens.
2) There are tons of factors that go into casting a role that has nothing to do with a person's ability and talent demonstrated at the audition! List them? I couldn't begin to, but here are some: physical appearance; how that match up physically with other actors; how they fit the director's concept; their reputation; past work; audience popularity; reliability; personality; work ethic; attitude; availability; conflicts with other actors and others working on the production; .... tons of things. Heck, it could be as simple as the costume won't fit.
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KEB
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Posted By: NDTENOR
Date Posted: 2/08/11 at 1:30am
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You know KEB54, I think that in an "ideal" world shouldn't have casing affected by anyone but the director . But that is what the "directors " seemed to say (but not do) . Or at least I think that is what they seem to say ( or not do ) . Oh yes ... it could be as simple as .... " The costume won't fit"... but I know it's not as simple as that...
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Posted By: Rorgg
Date Posted: 2/08/11 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by NDTENOR
Mr. Rorgg:
Thank you for your opinion and I appreciate your comment. But obviously there is a big difference between getting other peoples " unbiased" opinion about an audition and one which is "affected" by factors which have no particular connection to the persons ability to perform a particular role. If you can get others opinions on an audition which are fair and unbiased then I think that is a perfectly wonderful thing to do. Two or three heads are sometimes better than one.
But just how sure are you of that?
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Well, in this case, the producer was also my girlfriend, so that trust was implicit. :) But beside that, she's been in charge of this particular company since its inception, and had a lot of experience on the production and direction end with a sterling reputation, so I'd have taken it anyway.
Sure, you need to give appropriate weight to any advice you choose to accept, and also remember that ultimately, it's just advice. I made another choice in that same session that my AD&SM were leaning the other way on. I appreciated their opinions, but I was convinced of my own choice in that case.
Somewhat ironic that the more certain you are in your ability to ultimately make the right choice, the more you can take the opinion of others.
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Posted By: edh915
Date Posted: 2/08/11 at 9:54pm
A few more words on the subject:
My answer to question #1 is essentially unchanged. I've never looked at anyone through the lens of his/her associations within the theater community. I'm simply physically unable to do it. The only thing I have to work with (aside from any talent I may possess) is my integrity. I think I'm pretty well regarded in my local theater community. And I think it's (at least partially) because everyone knows that I'm open to all possibilities, and I never pre-cast. Sure, there are people I may have in mind for a particular part, and I may encourage them to come to auditions. But I promise nothing. They know they'll get a fair shake and that's enough for them - and for me.
When I hold auditions I leave myself open to all possibilities. As I said before, if I have direct, personal knowledge that any particular actor is difficult to work with, I won't cast them, however "talented" they might be. I like to foster an ensemble feeling with my casts. Everyone working to make the show the best it can be. We leave egos at the door. Also, during the auditioning process I make sure that everyone reads equally. That is, I make sure that no one can leave an audition of mine thinking that they'd been overlooked, or not given a proper chance to show what they could do.
(I actually did accidentally break that rule a few years ago. One actor told me, when I called to offer her a part, that she was sure she wasn't going to get the part because I'd only had her read once during the 2-1/2 hour audition session. The thing is, she was the first to read for that part and from that moment on she had the role. I kept looking to see if anyone would top her and they couldn't. I was so busy trying to be fair to the others, that I forgot to be fair to her. I felt so bad that I've sworn never to let that happen again.)
I know what some of the people who come to audition are capable of because I've seen them in other plays. I also flatter myself that I'm able to spot untapped talent. The actor who always plays the best friend or the next door neighbor and always in light comedy who shines when given the challenge of a weightier role. Or the person who you can just tell is better than they think they are. (An unusual situation actually. So many turn out to be not quite as good as they think they are.)
A small point of honor with me is to cast the show from the pool of talent that comes to the auditions. As long as I have enough people to fill my cast of characters, I do not and will not call around to try to snag someone who didn't come. It's part of the challenge of directing. To win the game with the hand that was dealt you. It's a continuing learning process - for my actors, and for me, too. But if I'm advertising my show as having "open auditions', I make damn sure they're honestly open. Sometimes my "vision" of the show has to be altered to suit the reality of the cast I've chosen; but we all manage to pull it off so the audiences, in particular, never guess that they've seen something less than what I was hoping to give them.
I live in an area that is blessed with a good deal of community theater. There are a dozen community theaters within a twenty mile radius of my house (Four within a three mile radius) and I work actively with half of them. And we actually have a talent base to accommodate them all. But it doesn't mean we don't have our casting problems from time to time. I directed "ART" a few years ago - a three character play - and only had two actors audition. In that situation, I did have to make some phone calls; but usually I don't.
Sorry to ramble, but as an actor, I've been to enough "open" auditions that were more "closed" than otherwise. I'm adamant that my auditions will never sink to that level. So far, so good. (Knock wood.)
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Posted By: NDTENOR
Date Posted: 2/08/11 at 11:58pm
I greatly appreciate the thoughtful comments of all. And that is what a public discussion should be.... the uncensored comments and ideas of all willing to contribute their ideas in a public forum in a reasonable and civilized manner... and it is up to those who read these comments to decide what is their own personal truth.
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