Community Theater Green Room Discussion Board: Reducing orchestra volume

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Verdier
Walk-On
Walk-On

Joined: 2/09/04
Location: Canada
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Posts: 0

Topic: Reducing orchestra volume
Posted: 5/26/09 at 1:49pm

Need some advice... our theatre does not have an orchestra pit, nor is the stage large enough to accommodate having the orchestra onstage during a musical. This means that when doing musicals, we remove several rows of seats on the SL side of the theatre to create a space for the orchestra. By basically putting the orchestra right there with the audience, the feedback we hear after every show is that the orchestra is too loud. Our sound tech does everything possible to control their volume, but it never seems to help. We have tried a few other remedies that have helped slightly but not much.

We would like to come to a more permanant and effective solution. One idea we have tossed around is creating some sort of see-through enclosure for the orchestra (the conductor needs to be able to see the stage). Does anyone have any suggestions for constructing this, or perhaps have any other creative solutions?

Thanks!

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Nanette
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Joined: 8/01/06
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Posts: 399

Posted: 5/26/09 at 4:06pm

I went to a show where they placed partitions, like you would use to make a cubicle, around the orchestra. The partitions were low enough for them to see, yet dampened the sound so that it wasn't overwhelming.

In a world of margarine, be butter!

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Gaafa
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Joined: 3/21/04
Location: Australia
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Posts: 1181

Posted: 5/27/09 at 8:12pm

DRAPES & curtaining will absorb the sound, as in apron curtain barriers behind the conductor, in a normal pit. Also behind the band will cut down sound bounce off the walls.

Joe
Western Gondawandaland
turn right @ Perth.
Hear the light & see the sound.
Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"}
May you always play
to a full house}

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pdavis69
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Joined: 3/26/06
Location: United States
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Posts: 437

Posted: 5/28/09 at 9:06am

Rig each orchestra member's seat with electricity. Any time a player is playing a bit too loud give them a jolt. By the second or third shot of current to the backside, I bet they control the volume better.

Sorry, not helpful, but I just couldnt avoid it.

Patrick L. Davis
Fort Findlay Playhouse

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Gaafa
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Joined: 3/21/04
Location: Australia
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Posts: 1181

Posted: 5/28/09 at 11:01pm

great suggestion Patrick!

One other thought comes to mind;-

LDI '97 - DMX512 Shock Collar

Proved to be very usefull!

Can by rigged to an audio volume controlled in the Bio Box, fully atomatic!

Joe
Western Gondawandaland
turn right @ Perth.
Hear the light & see the sound.
Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"}
May you always play
to a full house}

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musikman1
Lead
Lead

Joined: 4/06/08
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 35

Posted: 8/04/09 at 8:51pm

RE: Orchestra Too Loud

Some fixes:

1) Get together with the set designer and put the pit BEHIND the set. The orch can blow their collective butts off with no problem on the voices. Just have a small window for the conductor to look out OR put a camera out in the light/sound booth and run a video line back to the pit. And vice-versa to the stage if the actors need to see cues.

2) The other was similar to the other suggestion. If the pit HAS to be out in the theatre (the reason for the volume is that the orchesta is closer to the audience's ears than the actor's mouths/speakers!), you can build an easy "cage" around them with 4x8 flats, and stock the pit floor, the back walls AND the flats (the part that faces the orch) with carpet, old curtains, anything of a fabric source.

3) Have anybody with an amplifier (guitar, bass, keyboards, reed synth) setup their amplifier, so that the speaker does NOT face the audience, but faces THEMSELVES. This will keep the volume down as they don't want to blow their own ears out..

If you use (1), then you don't need an orch monitor for the singers.

If you use (2) backstage, you don't need a monitor.

If you use (2) or (3) down at the audience ear levels, then be sure to place a SMALL (10" + horn is fine!) monitor on the stage pointed toward the singers. ONLY feed the keyboard/master piano, and make sure the volume is suitable for the singers.

If I had a nickle for everytime the orchestra is placed IN FRONT OF the first row of seats, and no pit (on the audience ear level) and I got complaints about the orch being too loud....

WAR STORY: The worst was a production of Seussical, we were doing dress rehearsal with an acoustic piano and a cello... that's it, two instruments, and yes dear readers, "the music was too loud.."

Rick
http://www.bway2.com/tracks

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musikman1
Lead
Lead

Joined: 4/06/08
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 35

Posted: 8/04/09 at 8:53pm

RE: The dude that wanted to rig the orch seats with electricity..

I ACTUALLY had a show back in the 70's, where the director/stage manager (who called the show), had all the orch lights rigged back to his booth.

First sign of loud noise, he blinked, second sign, he shut off the power.. by the third performance, we had all memorized the music..

Rick
http://www.bway2.com/tracks

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Carol
Walk-On
Walk-On

Joined: 11/13/07
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 7

Posted: 10/14/09 at 6:27pm

Just an orchestra disaster story.

High school production of Oklahoma! - pit band is set up directly in front of the stage ( no orchestra pit....) We are in the middle of the dream ballet sequence - which we had rehearsed with the dry ice special effects only once at dress. Stage crew decided to make it really effective and went crazy on the dry ice...

The cold front hit the french horns first. Playing the clarinet book, and sitting the front, I couldn't tell what happened, just that the sound was horrific.. Then it started to freeze the rest of the brass. Here we are in the middle of the ballet - and the whole band is quickly going significantly out of tune!!!

They backed off on the dry ice after that fiasco!

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Lights and Sound
Community Theater Green Room Discussion Board :Producing Theater :Lights and Sound

Author	Message
Verdier Walk-On Joined: 2/09/04 Location: Canada Online Status: Offline Posts: 0	Topic: Reducing orchestra volume Posted: 5/26/09 at 1:49pm
	Need some advice... our theatre does not have an orchestra pit, nor is the stage large enough to accommodate having the orchestra onstage during a musical. This means that when doing musicals, we remove several rows of seats on the SL side of the theatre to create a space for the orchestra. By basically putting the orchestra right there with the audience, the feedback we hear after every show is that the orchestra is too loud. Our sound tech does everything possible to control their volume, but it never seems to help. We have tried a few other remedies that have helped slightly but not much. We would like to come to a more permanant and effective solution. One idea we have tossed around is creating some sort of see-through enclosure for the orchestra (the conductor needs to be able to see the stage). Does anyone have any suggestions for constructing this, or perhaps have any other creative solutions? Thanks!

	IP Logged

Nanette Celebrity Joined: 8/01/06 Online Status: Offline Posts: 399	Posted: 5/26/09 at 4:06pm
	I went to a show where they placed partitions, like you would use to make a cubicle, around the orchestra. The partitions were low enough for them to see, yet dampened the sound so that it wasn't overwhelming.
	In a world of margarine, be butter!
	IP Logged

Gaafa Celebrity Joined: 3/21/04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1181	Posted: 5/27/09 at 8:12pm
	DRAPES & curtaining will absorb the sound, as in apron curtain barriers behind the conductor, in a normal pit. Also behind the band will cut down sound bounce off the walls.
	Joe Western Gondawandaland turn right @ Perth. Hear the light & see the sound. Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"} May you always play to a full house}
	IP Logged

pdavis69 Celebrity Joined: 3/26/06 Location: United States Online Status: Offline Posts: 437	Posted: 5/28/09 at 9:06am
	Rig each orchestra member's seat with electricity. Any time a player is playing a bit too loud give them a jolt. By the second or third shot of current to the backside, I bet they control the volume better. Sorry, not helpful, but I just couldnt avoid it.
	Patrick L. Davis Fort Findlay Playhouse
	IP Logged

Gaafa Celebrity Joined: 3/21/04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1181	Posted: 5/28/09 at 11:01pm
	great suggestion Patrick! One other thought comes to mind;- LDI '97 - DMX512 Shock Collar Proved to be very usefull! Can by rigged to an audio volume controlled in the Bio Box, fully atomatic!
	Joe Western Gondawandaland turn right @ Perth. Hear the light & see the sound. Toi Toi Toi Chookas {{"chook [chicken] it is"} May you always play to a full house}
	IP Logged

musikman1 Lead Joined: 4/06/08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 35	Posted: 8/04/09 at 8:51pm
	RE: Orchestra Too Loud Some fixes: 1) Get together with the set designer and put the pit BEHIND the set. The orch can blow their collective butts off with no problem on the voices. Just have a small window for the conductor to look out OR put a camera out in the light/sound booth and run a video line back to the pit. And vice-versa to the stage if the actors need to see cues. 2) The other was similar to the other suggestion. If the pit HAS to be out in the theatre (the reason for the volume is that the orchesta is closer to the audience's ears than the actor's mouths/speakers!), you can build an easy "cage" around them with 4x8 flats, and stock the pit floor, the back walls AND the flats (the part that faces the orch) with carpet, old curtains, anything of a fabric source. 3) Have anybody with an amplifier (guitar, bass, keyboards, reed synth) setup their amplifier, so that the speaker does NOT face the audience, but faces THEMSELVES. This will keep the volume down as they don't want to blow their own ears out.. If you use (1), then you don't need an orch monitor for the singers. If you use (2) backstage, you don't need a monitor. If you use (2) or (3) down at the audience ear levels, then be sure to place a SMALL (10" + horn is fine!) monitor on the stage pointed toward the singers. ONLY feed the keyboard/master piano, and make sure the volume is suitable for the singers. If I had a nickle for everytime the orchestra is placed IN FRONT OF the first row of seats, and no pit (on the audience ear level) and I got complaints about the orch being too loud.... WAR STORY: The worst was a production of Seussical, we were doing dress rehearsal with an acoustic piano and a cello... that's it, two instruments, and yes dear readers, "the music was too loud.."
	Rick http://www.bway2.com/tracks
	IP Logged

musikman1 Lead Joined: 4/06/08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 35	Posted: 8/04/09 at 8:53pm
	RE: The dude that wanted to rig the orch seats with electricity.. I ACTUALLY had a show back in the 70's, where the director/stage manager (who called the show), had all the orch lights rigged back to his booth. First sign of loud noise, he blinked, second sign, he shut off the power.. by the third performance, we had all memorized the music..
	Rick http://www.bway2.com/tracks
	IP Logged

Carol Walk-On Joined: 11/13/07 Location: Canada Online Status: Offline Posts: 7	Posted: 10/14/09 at 6:27pm
	Just an orchestra disaster story. High school production of Oklahoma! - pit band is set up directly in front of the stage ( no orchestra pit....) We are in the middle of the dream ballet sequence - which we had rehearsed with the dry ice special effects only once at dress. Stage crew decided to make it really effective and went crazy on the dry ice... The cold front hit the french horns first. Playing the clarinet book, and sitting the front, I couldn't tell what happened, just that the sound was horrific.. Then it started to freeze the rest of the brass. Here we are in the middle of the ballet - and the whole band is quickly going significantly out of tune!!! They backed off on the dry ice after that fiasco!
	IP Logged

Topic: Reducing orchestra volume( Topic Closed)